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[09:52:30] <Tsvetan> adjtm rk3399 will never fit this form
[09:52:57] <Tsvetan> rk3328 probably will do it, we now experiment with RK3328-SOM204 to evaluate
[09:54:12] <Tsvetan> for the moment LIME2 does just fine in 99.9% use cases for our industrial customers, they do not want fancy graphics but to may create reliable M2M interface
[09:54:45] <Tsvetan> with SOM204 we want to give them some flexibility to scale without change their main boards
[09:55:27] <Tsvetan> I do not see any industrial use case for RK3399, 20W hungry monster
[10:21:24] <jo0nas> what I notice is an interest in more memory - as I understand it that will be addressed by RK3328 supporting up to 4GB RAM
[10:43:13] <voldial> Is there concensus on the next cpu for DIY-LAPTOP? I would love to have the possibility to build one with more than one with a pile of ram, I see the RK3399 maxes out at 8G :(
[10:53:15] <jo0nas> voldial: I would fear the heat of 20W!
[10:56:17] <voldial> jo0nas: I'd be happy dealing with that... what I am really looking for is a open source mb that I can mod to have like 32G (I dont care how fast), 4 cores min, and (critically) 4x m.2 slots so I can run a pari of big RAID 1's. I'm still chillin on a T420s with 16G because it has 2x 2.5" SATA slots and a minipci so I can have 3 drives.
[10:59:41] <voldial> are there any intel ref-ish designs with the board files posted? Prusim says they cant release because copyright nda whatever with the intel ref designs
[11:02:47] <jo0nas> voldial: I think you are talking about something radically different than the Teres-I with what you have in mind!
[11:04:02] <jo0nas> ...i.e. not just replacing a CPU as you started out talking about
[11:06:16] <voldial> jo0nas: ya. very. I cant seem to find one on the market that does that: https://bpaste.net/show/_XAG and it's annoying enough that I want to mod a board to make it happen. I've built and debugged 5 layer boards for ADC's with the help of layout experts in my lab, so I have the resources... but not the time to start from scratch.
[11:07:47] <voldial> (controllers for mass spec array detectors if you are wondering)
[11:32:19] <jo0nas> seems you _must_ start from scratch with those requirements of yours - or lower them to align with what exists lowadays: Only OSHW laptops in existence that I am aware of is Teres-I which you can expect to tweak to a CPU that can handle 4GB RAM
[11:33:04] <jo0nas> your specs seem to be tied to x86 stuff - you cannot expect same from ARM
[11:33:38] <jo0nas> or, if you expect same from ARM then you are no longer looking at OSHW but enterprise-level stuff where you need NDAs to touch it
[11:33:47] <voldial> Can the A64 or RK3399 do real SMP? Like 2 physical packages? Does that let me double the RAM? https://elinux.org/images/0/00/Clement-smp-bring-up-on-arm-soc.pdf so in theory one could put multiple physical A64's running one linux kernel? I searched the datacheet, "SMP" exists 4 times... and there's no context.
[11:34:58] <voldial> I looked at the Talon system too, but they dont provide schematics, just diagrams.
[11:35:13] <voldial> err. no board layout files etc
[11:38:31] <voldial> One other open hardware laptop is https://www.kosagi.com/w/index.php?title=Novena_Main_Page (I think that's in the spirit of the Teres-I, pls correct me if I'm missing something)
[11:40:51] <adjtm_> voldial, A64 and RK3399 do real SMP (the SOCs are multicore)
[11:41:03] <adjtm_> you can't do multipackage
[11:41:39] <adjtm_> and the physical address space is 4GB anyway
[11:42:38] <voldial> ah. I was afraid that's what that ment;)
[11:44:29] <voldial> so in the arm space, multipackage, is there anything other than ThunderX?
[11:45:45] <voldial> even old stuff is fine, I dont really care if it's fast, just lots of ram and enough pcie lanes
[11:51:11] <voldial> maybe something with LPAE?
[11:54:19] <jo0nas> voldial: if you only want "the spirit of Open Source Hardware" - in a relaxed interpretation of that expression - then there are more options indeed
[11:55:06] <voldial> that provide layout files? Other than Novena and Teres-I?
[11:55:17] <jo0nas> I am uncertain if Novena is in fact Open Source Hardware - might be...
[11:55:42] <voldial> ya, they provide it all
[11:56:16] <voldial> well... no lithography masks
[17:33:01] <jo0nas> xcko_: Any progress on the keyboard controller?
IRC #olimex 2019-08-29
[08:59:38] <leon-anavi> hi[09:52:30] <Tsvetan> adjtm rk3399 will never fit this form
[09:52:57] <Tsvetan> rk3328 probably will do it, we now experiment with RK3328-SOM204 to evaluate
[09:54:12] <Tsvetan> for the moment LIME2 does just fine in 99.9% use cases for our industrial customers, they do not want fancy graphics but to may create reliable M2M interface
[09:54:45] <Tsvetan> with SOM204 we want to give them some flexibility to scale without change their main boards
[09:55:27] <Tsvetan> I do not see any industrial use case for RK3399, 20W hungry monster
[10:21:24] <jo0nas> what I notice is an interest in more memory - as I understand it that will be addressed by RK3328 supporting up to 4GB RAM
[10:43:13] <voldial> Is there concensus on the next cpu for DIY-LAPTOP? I would love to have the possibility to build one with more than one with a pile of ram, I see the RK3399 maxes out at 8G :(
[10:53:15] <jo0nas> voldial: I would fear the heat of 20W!
[10:56:17] <voldial> jo0nas: I'd be happy dealing with that... what I am really looking for is a open source mb that I can mod to have like 32G (I dont care how fast), 4 cores min, and (critically) 4x m.2 slots so I can run a pari of big RAID 1's. I'm still chillin on a T420s with 16G because it has 2x 2.5" SATA slots and a minipci so I can have 3 drives.
[10:59:41] <voldial> are there any intel ref-ish designs with the board files posted? Prusim says they cant release because copyright nda whatever with the intel ref designs
[11:02:47] <jo0nas> voldial: I think you are talking about something radically different than the Teres-I with what you have in mind!
[11:04:02] <jo0nas> ...i.e. not just replacing a CPU as you started out talking about
[11:06:16] <voldial> jo0nas: ya. very. I cant seem to find one on the market that does that: https://bpaste.net/show/_XAG and it's annoying enough that I want to mod a board to make it happen. I've built and debugged 5 layer boards for ADC's with the help of layout experts in my lab, so I have the resources... but not the time to start from scratch.
[11:07:47] <voldial> (controllers for mass spec array detectors if you are wondering)
[11:32:19] <jo0nas> seems you _must_ start from scratch with those requirements of yours - or lower them to align with what exists lowadays: Only OSHW laptops in existence that I am aware of is Teres-I which you can expect to tweak to a CPU that can handle 4GB RAM
[11:33:04] <jo0nas> your specs seem to be tied to x86 stuff - you cannot expect same from ARM
[11:33:38] <jo0nas> or, if you expect same from ARM then you are no longer looking at OSHW but enterprise-level stuff where you need NDAs to touch it
[11:33:47] <voldial> Can the A64 or RK3399 do real SMP? Like 2 physical packages? Does that let me double the RAM? https://elinux.org/images/0/00/Clement-smp-bring-up-on-arm-soc.pdf so in theory one could put multiple physical A64's running one linux kernel? I searched the datacheet, "SMP" exists 4 times... and there's no context.
[11:34:58] <voldial> I looked at the Talon system too, but they dont provide schematics, just diagrams.
[11:35:13] <voldial> err. no board layout files etc
[11:38:31] <voldial> One other open hardware laptop is https://www.kosagi.com/w/index.php?title=Novena_Main_Page (I think that's in the spirit of the Teres-I, pls correct me if I'm missing something)
[11:40:51] <adjtm_> voldial, A64 and RK3399 do real SMP (the SOCs are multicore)
[11:41:03] <adjtm_> you can't do multipackage
[11:41:39] <adjtm_> and the physical address space is 4GB anyway
[11:42:38] <voldial> ah. I was afraid that's what that ment;)
[11:44:29] <voldial> so in the arm space, multipackage, is there anything other than ThunderX?
[11:45:45] <voldial> even old stuff is fine, I dont really care if it's fast, just lots of ram and enough pcie lanes
[11:51:11] <voldial> maybe something with LPAE?
[11:54:19] <jo0nas> voldial: if you only want "the spirit of Open Source Hardware" - in a relaxed interpretation of that expression - then there are more options indeed
[11:55:06] <voldial> that provide layout files? Other than Novena and Teres-I?
[11:55:17] <jo0nas> I am uncertain if Novena is in fact Open Source Hardware - might be...
[11:55:42] <voldial> ya, they provide it all
[11:56:16] <voldial> well... no lithography masks
[17:33:01] <jo0nas> xcko_: Any progress on the keyboard controller?
