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[18:57:00] <valhalla_> lol, I touught that the theres had a "serious" design bug, namely that the pattern for a neoprene sleeve for it would not fit on an A4 piece of paper. Instead the non-fitting pattern made a sleeve that is significantly bigger than needed.
[18:58:44] <nedko> valhalla_: you made a sleeve for teres?
[18:59:21] <valhalla_> nedko: at the moment I made a sleeve for an X200, apparently, but I still have some neoprene on the cutting table
[18:59:39] <valhalla_> the pattern will be published (with debian times)
[19:00:16] <nedko> debian times?
[19:00:23] <nedko> what does this mean?
[19:01:26] <valhalla_> that it will take a long time
[19:01:44] <nedko> as in debian having long release cycle?
[19:01:48] <valhalla_> i.e. will be published when it's ready
[19:02:37] <valhalla_> (not really as long as the myth goes, as nowadays it's once every two years, and the only fixed time is the freeze, not the release, but yes)
[19:02:41] <nedko> a pdf or png with drawing for teres sleeve would be useful
[23:27:59] <adj__> I vastly prefer debian release cycle than 6 month distributions
[23:28:31] <lukas2511> mhm... it depends.
[23:28:49] <adj__> but I would prefer if sid were a rolling release with testing just the same until freeze
[23:29:06] <lukas2511> you really get to dislike debians release cycle if you have new(ish) hardware that only really works great with newer versions of kernel, libgl, mesa, etc.
[23:29:24] <adj__> that's when a rolling release is handy
[23:30:20] <adj__> if you have some servers or micro servers a two year stable distribution is nice
[23:30:35] <nedko> I vastly prefer gentoo use flags. Too often, binary packet flavours are not suitable :)
[23:30:56] <nedko> *binary package
[23:31:09] <nedko> as in bsd and debian
[23:31:28] <nedko> e.g. emacs-nox
[23:31:56] <adj__> compiling software like gnome, kde, libreoffice... in many computers is really painfull
[23:32:00] <nedko> this particular one is suitable, though :)
[23:32:48] <adj__> I would like a way in debian to mark which packages you want to install building from source
[23:32:55] <adj__> in an easy way
[23:33:00] <lukas2511> i really liked nixos for that. mostly binary releases but very easy to change something and compile it from source while still having the ability to update everything
[23:33:48] <adj__> you should be able to do that with any distribution, and changing compiling options for selected packages
[23:34:31] <lukas2511> would be nice, but apt, dnf, pacman and most other package managers have no idea how to compile stuff, and there is no defined syntax on how to change stuff
[23:34:33] <adj__> I have tried others distributions many times, but in the end I always go back to debian
[23:35:20] <nedko> because of painful compiling?
[23:35:25] <lukas2511> yea well, on my servers i always go back to debian, on the desktop i like rolling releases
[23:35:59] <adj__> nedko, have you tried compiling libreoffice on olinuxinos?
[23:36:36] <adj__> and when there is an upgrade of a desktop, you usually update a lot of packages at the same time
[23:36:36] <nedko> no, i stopped using X11 years ago :)
[23:37:05] <adj__> but if the distribution includes that kind of software, people need to compile it
[23:37:35] <lukas2511> nedko: are you one of those "i send an url via emacs-mail to my server and it sends me back the websites content, i don't need a GUI" people?
[23:37:42] <adj__> I want to use some distributions of the kind of sabotage, alpine etc.
[23:37:45] <nedko> i'm not aware of distribution that cannot be run desktop-less
[23:38:00] <adj__> nedko, for sure
[23:38:27] <adj__> but then you can't run libreoffice, chromium, firefox, kicad, freecad etc.
[23:38:53] <nedko> lukas2511: quite possible, i feel i'm approaching such role at least :)
[23:39:29] <nedko> kicad wants opengl and is better implemented without X11
[23:39:44] <adj__> I neither use X11 on olinuxinos and some servers
[23:40:17] <nedko> *better to be implemented
[23:41:28] <adj__> kicad doesn't require opengl except for the new router
[23:41:29] <nedko> what people use freecad for?
[23:41:40] <adj__> mostly for CAD
[23:41:58] <lukas2511> you don't say?
[23:42:06] <adj__> :)
[23:42:09] <lukas2511> i thought people used it for making sandwiches
[23:42:15] <lukas2511> that changes everything
[23:42:22] <nedko> i thought there are CAD variants
[23:42:34] <adj__> mechanical CAD
[23:42:42] <lukas2511> it actually looks really cool
[23:42:53] <nedko> so for sadwich toasters too :)
[23:42:56] <lukas2511> the gui looks like it's actually a usable software
[23:43:00] <lukas2511> which is nice for a change
[23:43:04] <adj__> but it's really the best CAD for any mechanical or architectural CAD
[23:43:20] <nedko> i can more easily draw on paper :)
[23:43:38] <adj__> drawings are the past
[23:43:47] <adj__> nobody I know designs that way
[23:43:49] <lukas2511> except for drawings of unicorns
[23:43:53] <lukas2511> those are the future
[23:43:56] <lukas2511> obviously
[23:44:13] <adj__> lukas2511, that dream is an implant!
[23:44:24] <nedko> i do it in the present :)
[23:45:02] <nedko> it is much more pleasant than dealing with opengl setups
[23:45:18] <lukas2511> ooh i get it
[23:45:42] <lukas2511> he us a TERES user and found out that he can't really use the gpu, so now he tries to tell himself that he doesn't need a gui
[23:45:59] <nedko> what?
[23:46:02] <nedko> o.0
[23:46:14] <lukas2511> nedko: no no it's fine
[23:46:31] <nedko> i never tried to set opengl
[23:47:07] <nedko> i've done it before on amd64, i've been running EVE online with realtime kernel
[23:47:16] <nedko> so i've not tried on arm
[23:47:43] <nedko> kicad was problematic even on amd64
[23:48:29] <nedko> AFAIK it is possible to set opengl on a20 and a64
[23:48:36] <adj__> kicad's schematic editor is slower than the router module, very annoying
[23:49:06] <nedko> have you tried to fix it?
[23:49:24] <lukas2511> i tried fixing it by switching to eagle
[23:49:34] <nedko> i'd feel lucky if kicad works at all for me :)
[23:50:10] <lukas2511> nedko: try using a GUI, kicad works best that way
[23:50:21] <nedko> IIRC for eagle you need modern graphic web browser (aka application host)
[23:50:57] <nedko> lukas2511: one can run GUI on framebuffer, it is just that some software wants X11 and opengl :)
[23:51:05] <adj__> for CAD only alternative is openscad
[23:51:36] <nedko> pencil on paper works quite well for me :)
[23:51:45] <lukas2511> i actually did most of my CAD work in openscad, but it's very simple stuff, i think the most complicated was probably a mainboard i/o shield
[23:52:16] <lukas2511> nedko: i just find it hard to convert pencil drawings to gcode
[23:52:24] <lukas2511> but maybe that's just me
[23:52:51] <nedko> it depends on CAD you are doing i guess
[23:53:22] <nedko> for mechanical design of DIY stuff, it is quite easy for me
[23:53:43] <adj__> freecad is making great improvements
[23:53:59] <adj__> also kicad, by the way
[23:54:17] <lukas2511> i think i have to give kicad another try
[23:54:33] <lukas2511> last time i wanted to use it it just really didn't do what i expected it to do
[23:55:05] <lukas2511> like i wanted to move something very slightly on my pcb, and it just ripped all connections and i basically had to start over
[23:55:14] <adj__> it now have simulation integration
IRC #olimex 2018-01-08
[10:33:42] <leon-anavi> morning[18:57:00] <valhalla_> lol, I touught that the theres had a "serious" design bug, namely that the pattern for a neoprene sleeve for it would not fit on an A4 piece of paper. Instead the non-fitting pattern made a sleeve that is significantly bigger than needed.
[18:58:44] <nedko> valhalla_: you made a sleeve for teres?
[18:59:21] <valhalla_> nedko: at the moment I made a sleeve for an X200, apparently, but I still have some neoprene on the cutting table
[18:59:39] <valhalla_> the pattern will be published (with debian times)
[19:00:16] <nedko> debian times?
[19:00:23] <nedko> what does this mean?
[19:01:26] <valhalla_> that it will take a long time
[19:01:44] <nedko> as in debian having long release cycle?
[19:01:48] <valhalla_> i.e. will be published when it's ready
[19:02:37] <valhalla_> (not really as long as the myth goes, as nowadays it's once every two years, and the only fixed time is the freeze, not the release, but yes)
[19:02:41] <nedko> a pdf or png with drawing for teres sleeve would be useful
[23:27:59] <adj__> I vastly prefer debian release cycle than 6 month distributions
[23:28:31] <lukas2511> mhm... it depends.
[23:28:49] <adj__> but I would prefer if sid were a rolling release with testing just the same until freeze
[23:29:06] <lukas2511> you really get to dislike debians release cycle if you have new(ish) hardware that only really works great with newer versions of kernel, libgl, mesa, etc.
[23:29:24] <adj__> that's when a rolling release is handy
[23:30:20] <adj__> if you have some servers or micro servers a two year stable distribution is nice
[23:30:35] <nedko> I vastly prefer gentoo use flags. Too often, binary packet flavours are not suitable :)
[23:30:56] <nedko> *binary package
[23:31:09] <nedko> as in bsd and debian
[23:31:28] <nedko> e.g. emacs-nox
[23:31:56] <adj__> compiling software like gnome, kde, libreoffice... in many computers is really painfull
[23:32:00] <nedko> this particular one is suitable, though :)
[23:32:48] <adj__> I would like a way in debian to mark which packages you want to install building from source
[23:32:55] <adj__> in an easy way
[23:33:00] <lukas2511> i really liked nixos for that. mostly binary releases but very easy to change something and compile it from source while still having the ability to update everything
[23:33:48] <adj__> you should be able to do that with any distribution, and changing compiling options for selected packages
[23:34:31] <lukas2511> would be nice, but apt, dnf, pacman and most other package managers have no idea how to compile stuff, and there is no defined syntax on how to change stuff
[23:34:33] <adj__> I have tried others distributions many times, but in the end I always go back to debian
[23:35:20] <nedko> because of painful compiling?
[23:35:25] <lukas2511> yea well, on my servers i always go back to debian, on the desktop i like rolling releases
[23:35:59] <adj__> nedko, have you tried compiling libreoffice on olinuxinos?
[23:36:36] <adj__> and when there is an upgrade of a desktop, you usually update a lot of packages at the same time
[23:36:36] <nedko> no, i stopped using X11 years ago :)
[23:37:05] <adj__> but if the distribution includes that kind of software, people need to compile it
[23:37:35] <lukas2511> nedko: are you one of those "i send an url via emacs-mail to my server and it sends me back the websites content, i don't need a GUI" people?
[23:37:42] <adj__> I want to use some distributions of the kind of sabotage, alpine etc.
[23:37:45] <nedko> i'm not aware of distribution that cannot be run desktop-less
[23:38:00] <adj__> nedko, for sure
[23:38:27] <adj__> but then you can't run libreoffice, chromium, firefox, kicad, freecad etc.
[23:38:53] <nedko> lukas2511: quite possible, i feel i'm approaching such role at least :)
[23:39:29] <nedko> kicad wants opengl and is better implemented without X11
[23:39:44] <adj__> I neither use X11 on olinuxinos and some servers
[23:40:17] <nedko> *better to be implemented
[23:41:28] <adj__> kicad doesn't require opengl except for the new router
[23:41:29] <nedko> what people use freecad for?
[23:41:40] <adj__> mostly for CAD
[23:41:58] <lukas2511> you don't say?
[23:42:06] <adj__> :)
[23:42:09] <lukas2511> i thought people used it for making sandwiches
[23:42:15] <lukas2511> that changes everything
[23:42:22] <nedko> i thought there are CAD variants
[23:42:34] <adj__> mechanical CAD
[23:42:42] <lukas2511> it actually looks really cool
[23:42:53] <nedko> so for sadwich toasters too :)
[23:42:56] <lukas2511> the gui looks like it's actually a usable software
[23:43:00] <lukas2511> which is nice for a change
[23:43:04] <adj__> but it's really the best CAD for any mechanical or architectural CAD
[23:43:20] <nedko> i can more easily draw on paper :)
[23:43:38] <adj__> drawings are the past
[23:43:47] <adj__> nobody I know designs that way
[23:43:49] <lukas2511> except for drawings of unicorns
[23:43:53] <lukas2511> those are the future
[23:43:56] <lukas2511> obviously
[23:44:13] <adj__> lukas2511, that dream is an implant!
[23:44:24] <nedko> i do it in the present :)
[23:45:02] <nedko> it is much more pleasant than dealing with opengl setups
[23:45:18] <lukas2511> ooh i get it
[23:45:42] <lukas2511> he us a TERES user and found out that he can't really use the gpu, so now he tries to tell himself that he doesn't need a gui
[23:45:59] <nedko> what?
[23:46:02] <nedko> o.0
[23:46:14] <lukas2511> nedko: no no it's fine
[23:46:31] <nedko> i never tried to set opengl
[23:47:07] <nedko> i've done it before on amd64, i've been running EVE online with realtime kernel
[23:47:16] <nedko> so i've not tried on arm
[23:47:43] <nedko> kicad was problematic even on amd64
[23:48:29] <nedko> AFAIK it is possible to set opengl on a20 and a64
[23:48:36] <adj__> kicad's schematic editor is slower than the router module, very annoying
[23:49:06] <nedko> have you tried to fix it?
[23:49:24] <lukas2511> i tried fixing it by switching to eagle
[23:49:34] <nedko> i'd feel lucky if kicad works at all for me :)
[23:50:10] <lukas2511> nedko: try using a GUI, kicad works best that way
[23:50:21] <nedko> IIRC for eagle you need modern graphic web browser (aka application host)
[23:50:57] <nedko> lukas2511: one can run GUI on framebuffer, it is just that some software wants X11 and opengl :)
[23:51:05] <adj__> for CAD only alternative is openscad
[23:51:36] <nedko> pencil on paper works quite well for me :)
[23:51:45] <lukas2511> i actually did most of my CAD work in openscad, but it's very simple stuff, i think the most complicated was probably a mainboard i/o shield
[23:52:16] <lukas2511> nedko: i just find it hard to convert pencil drawings to gcode
[23:52:24] <lukas2511> but maybe that's just me
[23:52:51] <nedko> it depends on CAD you are doing i guess
[23:53:22] <nedko> for mechanical design of DIY stuff, it is quite easy for me
[23:53:43] <adj__> freecad is making great improvements
[23:53:59] <adj__> also kicad, by the way
[23:54:17] <lukas2511> i think i have to give kicad another try
[23:54:33] <lukas2511> last time i wanted to use it it just really didn't do what i expected it to do
[23:55:05] <lukas2511> like i wanted to move something very slightly on my pcb, and it just ripped all connections and i basically had to start over
[23:55:14] <adj__> it now have simulation integration
